Join us, as Miriam also joins us (as she does apparently every 17 episodes), as we uncover Patrick Brice's follow-up to CREEP (2014): CREEP 2 (2017)! Welcome to SPOOKY PENIS SEASON, GUYS!!!
And so it begins. Year two of "Spooky Penis Month!" Or as Miriam aptly retitled it, "Freaky Phallus Friday!"
As you might be able to tell from the title, or within less than a minute into this, Miriam joins us again in the studio to talk about a horror film staring Mark Duplass. Last time, we promised her a horror movie, and not a James Ivory peiod piece romp in the lake. What she got is (according to Ryan and Miriam) a horribly mediocre sequel that just so happens to have full-frontal: CREEP 2 (2017). Let's see how everyone felt about this? Well, actually, we just gave it away...
Laura: Thousand dollars a day ain't too bad.
Ryan: That's actually very good.
Laura: It's a good rate.
Ryan: Yeah, that's a solid rate. Solid rate.
Laura: Well, hello, uh, there. Welcome to On the BiTTE the podcast that uncovers full, gentle male nudity in cinema. My name is Laura, and I am joined by my co host, Ryan.
Ryan: Hello.
Laura: And even more excitingly, I am joined by our dear, dear friend, Miriam. Hi, Miriam.
Miriam: Hello again, ladies and gentlemen. I'm pleased to join you for another film. And phallus.
Laura: Excellent. Well, this is, uh, what did you call it, Miriam? Freaky phallus Friday.
Miriam: Yeah, I sure did.
Laura: Okay. Yeah, it used to be Spooky Penis Month.
Ryan: Freaky phallus Friday.
Laura: Yeah. That doesn't mean the penises are freaky, but they are. Maybe in a freaky context. We are here to talk about the horror film from 2017, Creep Two, starring, uh, Mark Duplass, desiree Acovan, and directed by Patrick Bryce.
Laura: So I know you've got a couple things to say about Patrick Ryan.
Ryan: Yes.
Laura: And, um, yeah, why don't you go ahead and give us a rundown?
Ryan: Yeah, I'll get it out the way. Um, so Patrick Bryce is a director, writer, actor, and cinematographer. Um, so let's just say Creep was his first feature film. It was his directorial debut, and effectively begins his relationship with this man called Duplass. Um, obviously, Mark Duplass has gone on to do his own kind of filmography, um, with obviously Duplass Productions making their own films. And, uh, yeah. Ah, that's like Cyrus the Puffy Chair, Baghdad Jeff, uh, who lives at home, like that sort of stuff. But I remember him more fondly from the league as an actor. But yeah, uh, Patrick shot creep. And also creep, too. That's why he's declared a cinematographer.
Miriam: Ah.
Ryan: Um, and I put that in speech marks because I don't think there's anything pretty about these two films.
Laura: Um, I disagree.
Ryan: But, um, he's also made a bunch of other stuff. Uh, there's obviously Creep in 2014, the Overnight in 2015 that has penises in it. Oh, the overnight.
Laura: Yeah.
Ryan: So we'll have to this fake fuck. Oh, they're fake.
Miriam: What?
Laura: They're super fake.
Ryan: Okay.
Miriam: Fake dicks.
Ryan: Come on, Charlatans. Um, and then obviously, we're covering Creep Two today, which was made in 2017. But, uh, just again, I cover everything else. He also made a movie called Corporate Animals in 2019. There's someone inside your house in 2021. Um, he also directed, uh, hay loose. He was also the co director on that movie. And he's also done episodes of Room 104. Um, let's just say a lot of this stuff's on Netflix. He's got a kind of partnership with Netflix. So, um, that's kind of primarily where all of his work is, uh, situated at the moment. Um, I don't really have much to say about the guy. I mean, the dude's working and making stuff, and it feels like a relatively quite mediocre, middling sort of body of work. What we will find out as this goes on how I feel about this at all.
Laura: At all.
Laura: Well, uh, Mark Duplass plays Aaron, and in the first film, he was so and then we come to learn that he basically takes the name of his victims because Aaron in the first movie was played by Patrick Bryce, who he murdered M, and then assumed his identity.
Ryan: It's also not Aaron. It's Aaron.
Laura: Okay.
Ryan: Yeah, I thought it was eren because they say Eren, but it's Aaron.
Miriam: Just makes it more guttural when it's Aaron and not know it's just a little bit more those he likes those guttural sounds, doesn't he?
Ryan: We know that no one from a, uh, Celtic persuasion has any way of being able to roll their R's effectively. You are correct, Aaron Basil.
Miriam: Um, well, it's easier for those of us who grew up in South Florida because you have a lot of the Latin American influence. So if you can't do your it's, you have a problem. You got to be able to pronounce things correctly. It's not burrito. Burrito.
Laura: I can't do that.
Miriam: Come on.
Ryan: You haven't got the spice. M. Yeah, you don't have the spice.
Miriam: Well, the hardest one, I think, for a lot of people is the German like, because it's like when you're gargling, it's like all the way in the.
Laura: Back of your throat.
Miriam: And it's like if you can't make the you can't speak German and then you just sound like a bad Indiana Jones film. And we love them, but come on, that's not what we sound like.
Ryan: Yeah, look at you with your German heritage.
Laura: Yeah, they'll never accept no.
Miriam: Feel like the castle in the film is that famous German Nurenberg castle, like the one in the Schwazzwald, like the famous fairy tale castle. Which is really funny because it makes kind of sense with this whole big bad wolf obsession thing that he has. Um, all that Grimm's fairy tale stuff that are alluded to in the film.
Laura: Peach fuz.
Miriam: Just like the woods, the wolf, the bridge. The concept of the bridge is a big deal because the bridge is like where you pay the troll toll. And also there's a lot of it just felt very grim. fairytaley.
Ryan: Yes. Some would even say trophy horror film comedy.
Miriam: Clearly, we all know that it's kind of supposed to be a dark comedy, right? It's not like scary.
Laura: Yeah, I definitely think they went for more comedy in this one than they did in the Mean. Yeah, we'd probably very awkward.
Miriam: Like, um, Larry David level awkward. Cringy.
Laura: Yeah, definitely.
Laura: So let me throw out there the synopsis before we get too deep. And, uh, it's long, so just be warned. After finding an ad online for video work, sarah, a video artist whose primary focus is creating intimacy with lonely men, thinks she may have found the subject of her dreams. She drives to a remote house in the forest and meets a man claiming to be a serial killer. Unable to resist the chance to create a truly shocking piece of art, she agrees to spend the day with him. However, as the day goes on, she discovers she may have dug herself into a hole from which she can't escape. Wow.
Miriam: Is that really it?
Ryan: That's pretty much the entire movie that.
Miriam: Was on the box. I love it when back of the box in the VHS store. The whole plot.
Ryan: Yes.
Laura: Um, let me give you the tagline, which is kind of weird. Oh, my god. This is going to be a good day. That's the tagline.
Miriam: That's weird.
Ryan: It's a line from the movie, right?
Miriam: I don't yeah, it's the line that the guy says, um, when he first meets him, when he tells the story about when he was a little boy and the creepy dude picks him up off the side of the road and beats him to death or whatever.
Laura: Another line I liked, which I meant to drop in the beginning of the episode, was let's go deep together. From his ad.
Ryan: Um, what a missed opportunity.
Laura: I was like, Ryan, Miriam, let's go deep together.
Miriam: Yeah.
Laura: Much of this film was actually improvised, if you didn't know that, because they only had a written outline to work with.
Ryan: You're joking.
Laura: I'm not.
Ryan: I can't believe it.
Laura: I feel like you're joking.
Ryan: I am. You're going to tell me it was shot in, like, two days?
Laura: Six days.
Ryan: Oh, fucking looks like it.
Miriam: Cool.
Ryan: God, you guys, I kind of wanted to do, uh, like a brief overview of this subgenre just now before we kind of get into the meat and.
Laura: The bones of this thing, like found footage films.
Ryan: This falls into the documentary or the mockumentary or the found footage, um, subgenre of horror, which has obviously been popularized since Blair Witch came out in like 97 or 98, or whatever it was. And since then, there's been at least 400 different films with almost this exact same sort of stylist like concept. And, uh, as thus created a fairly, uh, abundant list of trophy things, uh, that categorize this particular subgenre. And I mean, I'll list off some films.
Laura: Um, wait, I want to see how many Miriam can name found footage films other than Blair Witch.
Ryan: Actually, hold on. Let me get my pen out first. And I'll cross off the ones that I have on my list.
Laura: Because we know that Miriam loves horror movies. And this is why she's on this episode. Because we made her do that James Ivory ah picture. Um, which is very funny, actually. Did you know, Miriam, that was episode 17. And if I'm not mistaken, I believe this is episode 34.
Ryan: Yeah.
Miriam: Oh, look at that. You're only allowed on this is my lucky number. It's only on every 17th episode. Fantastic. I love this.
Ryan: Yeah. It's only taken us 17 episodes to sort our shit out.
Laura: Yeah. From February. Well, until end of September.
Miriam: Waiting for that okay. Um, well, off the top of my head, obviously, you've got ones that are of a genre that's m maybe not necessarily horror. You've got all those kind of like Cloverfield movies that are kind of meant to be found footage, but you're just like, nice. That's one camera in that scene. Who's holding that camera? Really? That's not come on.
Laura: All right. Abram.
Ryan: No, they show you. It's one of the partygoers in that.
Miriam: Yeah, yeah. They just pass in the camera around you're like, really? It's the end of the world. I'm not letting some random scaboy take my camera that they can sell for, like, a bus ticket out of here.
Ryan: Well, I don't know, Maryam. Everyone's on their phone now, uh, taking videos, trying to instigate some sort of situation so they can go viral. It makes sense. Just pass over the incredibly high quality HD camera that's shooting in four k and it never stops recording.
Miriam: Yeah, exactly. And it just happens to come with, like, a drone mount as well.
Ryan: Um, yeah, of course it moves there's.
Miriam: Like the Hell House LLC ones, which I really enjoy because I love the types of found footage movies.
Ryan: Yes. No, that's another one. That is too those are great.
Miriam: Um, no, I love that one. Okay, calm down. And I'm just talking about why I like them. Then you have your Paranormal Activity One.
Ryan: There we go.
Miriam: That's three, which is not found footage, but it's like security. Um, and then you've got the ones that are filmed on your video cameras, like the Korean ones, where it's like the zombie apocalypse is happening, but he's just, like, sending TikToks and Instagrams and Twitter. I think that counts.
Ryan: Um, that's probably here. I don't know if it's on my list.
Miriam: There's only so much paper which is found footage. Jeez.
Laura: Wow.
Miriam: You really know more than a lot, obviously. But there's another one that I really enjoy. It's what I watched recently, and it's found footage in the fact that they were all doing, like, a live video stream that was being recorded and it was actually done during lockdown, and it was all over their computers and there was like, a demon that they accidentally summoned. Host via. Is that it?
Ryan: Yeah, it's called host.
Miriam: Yeah, that one was really good.
Ryan: Um, four.
Laura: She's good. I tell you.
Miriam: There's probably a lot more, but I've been put on the spot.
Laura: You've done really well for being on the spot. I have to say.
Ryan: You did well. I mean, you probably should have prepared for this.
Miriam: Well, I didn't know you were going to quiz me. And allegedly, they say that The Texas Chainsaw Massacres based on found footage, but it was the 70s, so they probably just didn't but I'm sure you're going to start naming a bunch and I'm just going to be like, seen it, seen it. But I forgot that that's what it was. Yeah, well, the thing is, otherwise, I'm a charlatan.
Ryan: I am not here to trip you up. I just thought, let's just look at how oversaturated this entire genre is because it's tiresome and we'll try and go in an order. And I mean, some of these I've seen some of them I've not, um so we have the taking of Deborah Logan, wreck, Troll Hunter, Lake Mungo, noroy The Curse Cannibal Holocaust, which is actually earlier than, uh, Blair Witch in 1980. And then we have VHS the Poughkeepsie tapes. Um, and the last one I'll note is we saw at the Orlando Film Festival was Dash, uh, Cam.
Laura: Who did that again?
Ryan: Uh, do you remember some guy who made movies great. Um, I didn't like it very much. Yeah, I didn't like it very much.
Laura: I thought it was fine.
Miriam: There's a lot do you not like the genre in general? Or is it that it's just oversaturated? That anything that it had has been just taken away by the sheer shite that's been put out afterwards?
Ryan: I feel like if you're going to do something like it, it has to have some sort of level of punch to it. And I think Dash Cam, when we saw it recently and, uh, that's a 2022 movie does do some things relatively quite well if it's slightly marred by some references to the shadier sides of current, uh, societal issues that we're also dealing with and have been dealing with for the last kind of two years. Um, but I, uh, feel like it has become particularly tired. And certainly if you take any sort of series of films that's like that, I think Paranormal Activity is definitely one where you're like, oh, I feel like they're just repeating the same film like seven times.
Laura: Well, yeah, I stopped watching those. Yeah, but the first one is so good.
Ryan: But they also I mean, that's that's part of the third one. That's part of any horror anthology, you know, like Friday the 13th or Nightmare on Elm Street or the Chucky movies. They all have to hit certain things for you to accept them as what they are. But then we watched child's play recently.
Laura: Yeah, because that movie is amazing because.
Ryan: You dressed up as Chucky. Like, one day by accident.
Laura: I had an outfit and it was accidentally, uh, Chucky.
Ryan: It was just chucky.
Laura: Yeah.
Ryan: Uh, because you dress like, uh, an inanimate doll that's marketed to like six year olds.
Laura: Yeah, like a little boy doll. The hottest little boy doll you've ever seen.
Ryan: I want that as my friend. Yeah. No, she's my friend, fool.
Laura: I wanted to bring it back to Desiree, who plays Sarah. Um, so it's interesting because she and Mark Duplass met at a pool party and I guess they were playing some sort of game and they got paired up together and then they just got on like a house on fire. So he really liked her. He liked her style. So when they went to cast this film, he was like, I think this is one person that could go up against Aaron. Uh, aaron for sure. I can't do it. I'm not Aaron. Arden.
Miriam: Arden arin.
Ryan: Joseph. His name in the credits is Joseph on Letterboxd, but it's different on the film.
Laura: On the film. It's Aaron.
Ryan: Yeah, but on, uh, letterboxed is Joseph. Arun. I can't arun.
Laura: So, uh, they thought she would be a good kind of opponent, uh, just because she kind of has that attitude and that vibe. She's got that too. But she's an actor, writer, director in her own right as well. Um, she's a filmmaker. The last thing she wrote and directed was 2000 and Eighteen's the Miseducation of Cameron Post, who, uh, it stars Chloe Grace moretz. So she makes stuff. She makes stuff, too. Just throwing that out there. Um, and they also Patrick Bryce and Desiree would switch back and forth between who was handling the camera because it was a really small crew, obviously. Um, she's a cinematographer, too. Wow.
Ryan: Roger Deacons must be shaking in his boots.
Laura: You're going to like this, Ryan, because Mark Duplass didn't think that Creep Two was as good as it should have been.
Ryan: At least he's self aware.
Laura: Well, there's one moment that I remember specifically, and I don't know if you reacted the same way, Miriam, um, because we watched this together back when was that? 2018.
Miriam: Where were you living, Laura? That's the only way I can remember.
Laura: What year it was. I had just moved to Scotland. Okay, so you came to help me move. Uh, you met me in Manchester.
Miriam: Yes.
Laura: And we took the train over with the dog and we were staying in.
Miriam: That weird. We made those poor men, uh, tear open the train toilet because we were going to die. And we were like, we don't care if this fucking toilet is out of order. This girl just flew here and then had to deal with this dog and she has got to fucking pee. So open that shit with a crowbar. And then we went in together and we were just like, laughing with embarrassment because they couldn't quite close the door and they had to manually pry the Great Western Railway toilet open.
Laura: Yeah, that was a pretty bad situation. That toilet was very full. We just had to add to that situation and just close the toilet. Hope it didn't slosh over.
Ryan: Full of what?
Laura: Like pee pee. Um, everyone else's pee was not full of anyway.
Miriam: And then we got to Edinburgh and we got into a little black cab and he was so excited about mouth. And then we went to Laura's. First place of slumber in Scotland.
Laura: We did. And we basically lived off of cheese and whiskey for a solid week before the festival started. Like, genuinely. So much cheese and RuPaul's dragon.
Ryan: You know, there's more shops than just the whiskey and cheese. You didn't have to pick up your I wonder what they eat in Scotland. Nothing but cheese and whiskey.
Laura: I just wanted but like mostly cheese and whiskey. You know what?
Ryan: Yeah, the more I think about it yeah.
Laura: The more it makes sense.
Ryan: The more I'm like, yeah. No, that does make sense.
Laura: I'm sure there's photos of us sitting in that weird living room, Miriam, picking, uh, horror movies to watch and downing an entire bottle of whiskey in one sitting.
Miriam: Oh, yeah. 100%, for sure. I was like, finally, Laura and I can just drink whiskey and watch horror movies and watch Ryan's favorite piece of cinema, the boy.
Laura: Oh, yeah, the boy.
Ryan: Oh, the fucking boy.
Laura: Um, in the beginning of the movie, before even the titles happened, Miriam, did you have that same reaction where Aaron.
Ryan: Aaron, um.
Laura: Where he slices that guy's throat the very beginning of the film?
Miriam: Oh, the really.
Laura: Cute he's like, I just don't want to tell you what I'm going to tell you, but I've been filming our entire relationship. I've been stalking you.
Miriam: And then I was like, no, not him.
Laura: He did it so fast. You see the knife on his leg and he goes sloosh slices his throat. Both Ryan and I at the same time went, whoa.
Miriam: Yeah. And it was like the same schwa blood all over the wall. And then the guy you can just hear him just being like and then he's like, I'm 40. And I was like, oh my god. When we watched that movie, I wasn't 40 yet. And then this time I was like, HM. Yeah, I feel you, dude.
Laura: You really felt it, right? Like it really connected with you. That murder.
Miriam: I feel that about other things. Not murder. But I get you. You're 40. You're having a crisis. Um, I'm there with you. Well, he's 40.
Laura: And he's coming up on his 40th kill.
Miriam: He's the in between kill. Creep One was the kill that we witnessed. And then this guy is, uh, a movie that wasn't shot. We saw the ending of which then moves into Creep Two, where now he's just putting ads out because he's sad because he had a really lackluster kill with this really cute guy that he thought he was going to have a good time with. And he didn't.
Ryan: Right? Okay.
Miriam: And I bet you in the future we're going to see Creep Three, which is just going to be the movie that was the ending that we already know. Because they're going to be like it's going to be a twist. And you're like, we know the ending.
Laura: Yeah. That's something that they're working on. I know that they wanted to make a Creep Three.
Ryan: But yeah, it's in the works. That's the one I didn't talk about. Because, um yeah, I don't know. Whatever.
Laura: Well, uh, he doesn't want to do it until it's perfect because he wasn't totally satisfied with Creep Two. So doing a creep three, he's like, I've got it. We have to have a perfect idea. It has to be different. It has to move to another level.
Ryan: Good luck.
Laura: Did you guys think that Sarah's encounters YouTube series was actually pretty interesting? Because I did.
Miriam: Oh, 100%. I thought that was because, um, I remember knowing ah, Sarah, um, when I first moved to Europe and she was from the States but had been in Europe, and she was like, oh, no. And I just remember her telling me that she doesn't have a real job. And I was like, what do you do? And she's like, oh, um, I go around and I cuddle people. I was like, I'm sorry, excuse me. She's like, yeah, I go online and I go and I see these ads, and it's for lonely people who just want to be held or coddled or cuddled or they want to go on a picnic and be fed because it's never happened to them. And it's just like they fetishized it, but there's no sex involved. I'm just like sometimes I pretend to be their mom or like, they've never had a sister. And I'm like, sitting there going, uh, excuse me. You do what? That is very interesting and a little bit scary. And she's like, no, because they don't want to have sex. And in a weird way, I found it to be slightly creepier than if you just met up and had sex with people. I don't know why I was just like, someone wants to pretend to be a baby and you're their mom and you're singing them lullabies. I don't know why that just makes me feel more uncomfortable than a guy just, like, showing you a dick pic and being like you into it. I don't know.
Laura: It's interesting because it's such a vulnerable thing that you're jumping into. But I mean, if you get paid, I don't know if it's something she liked to do.
Ryan: Probably got paid, uh, until you start changing. Matthews yeah.
Miriam: I get the whole cuddle puddle. I totally get the cuddle puddle. And I get know, wanting to meet up with people to like, for sure. But like, the whole, like I don't know, I've just never really been into people pretending to be babies.
Laura: It's something. It sure is something.
Miriam: It can be your thing. It can be anybody's thing. But Miriam just wouldn't be interested in playing mom, so she's letting you know.
Laura: You don't want to cuddle a sexy baby.
Miriam: Um, no.
Ryan: Hora you're getting yourself into some dangerous.
Laura: Territory here our little boy doll, and there's sexy babies.
Ryan: Yeah. No, there's something wrong with you. Like, mentally.
Miriam: Every single thing that you always tell yourself that you're like, okay, I've just found myself in a situation where there's a chance that's pretty big one, that this person is a murderer. A, uh, killer, like in all the movies. And your first thought is, like, just be cool and try to befriend the psycho killer by pretending to also be a psycho so that you can get your Opportune moment and escape. And this movie, up until halfway through, you're like, this chick is a genius. She is pretty much just like playing mind games with this guy to find a way for him to trust her so she can escape. And then you're like, wait. No. But yeah.
Ryan: The one thing this film kind of does, which kind of, uh, defies expectation, is that he buries the lead by saying, I'm a killer. I have killed people. I will kill people. This is going to happen. So you are kind of half expecting, oh, well, at least he's burying the lead. There's no secrecy here. It's not like she's under any sort of misconception, uh, as to what, uh, his goals are.
Ryan: But overall, I don't know how much that the thing is by putting something out there on Front Street, there has to be a level of believability. And I don't know, there's part of me that doesn't think Mark Duplass can even carry a role where he is a killer. There is a movie that does this concept better, and it's called Man Bites Dog, where it's a mockumentary movie, um, about a documentary crew that follows a literal serial killer who goes around killing. And they film the killings as they happen. That's maybe something that creep two maybe needed was a little bit more of that.
Laura: Yeah, but you don't want to replicate something that's already happened and something that already has a bit of notoriety.
Ryan: I'd prefer it to have some level of believability, give it a little bit of weight. Because as much as there's all this philosophizing and he's got this delusion of grandeur, which is a trait of most serial killers, um, it's kind of nothing. But it's lacking a lot of substance other than it's just like here's a lot of fluff. It's filling up the time in the movie. And then I'll chase you at the end.
Laura: There is the part in the film where they're in the forest and they're trying to get that perfect shot in the light. And he's sitting in the little creek and she's filming him.
Miriam: That's the Ryan scene. That scene was so funny.
Laura: Went on way too long, in my opinion.
Ryan: Does that mean I'm pretentious, like, what's going on?
Miriam: But it was just he kept trying to film it and then just like, it wouldn't happen. And then he almost got it right. And she was like, I know he's a perfectionist about videos, so I'm just going to have to tell him that he's in the shadow. And he was just like, I can't anymore. You have to leave. I was just like, uh, I've never seen Ryan's process, but I imagine he's a director, cinematographer, and every single one of them has had this moment. And it's just really funny because I'm going to be sharing the podcast with someone who actually knows what they're doing.
Ryan: I am a bit of a perfectionist. That's not a lie. Yeah, no, that's true. Uh, you're not wrong. You're very correct.
Miriam: Birds.
Laura: That part is funny. That part is good.
Miriam: The part with the birds where he's like, I dare you. Do it again. I want you to do it again. And then he just starts fucking screaming and throwing the rocks of the bird. Then he has that moment with a ponytail. He's like, how's my tail? Uh, and she fixes it and he's just like, oh, so we're just going to redo the whole thing then? That's not what I asked, but okay, fine. Maybe that's why you're a shitty serial killer now. Because before you were like a nine to five serial killer. You had, like, a shitty job and you had to go to the bad bar with the people you don't like to talk about, the Kardashians. And then you got a better job because you're assuming all these identities. And now you're kind of like, rich, and so now you're like a yuppie bar.
Ryan: Do you go to talking about the Kardashians? The fucking kardashians.
Miriam: That's what people who have no lives talk about at a water cooler in an office, I guess. I don't know. I don't work in an office building. I have no idea.
Ryan: I don't know. I think you just talk about pornography when you're at the water cooler.
Laura: Yeah.
Ryan: Pornography and sports. Yeah, I saw that touchdown. Then I saw that cream pie on the movies.
Laura: Oh, my God. Wow.
Laura: Um, so there's a really important scene that we haven't touched on yet, and it comes in at 24 minutes and 56 seconds into this film.
Ryan: Is this the dick scene?
Laura: This is the dick scene.
Ryan: Wow.
Laura: And I like this part very much. And it's my favorite part of the film. Not only because it is a full frontal nudity scene, but because I don't know why, but it's the most interesting part of the story in terms of his character and her character getting to know each other.
Miriam: Definitely.
Laura: But it's different in the fact that you have a static shot, a full body shot of this naked man standing there holding his leg ever just so.
Miriam: His leg the leg. I couldn't get over the leg. The slight leg was killing me.
Laura: The leg was killing me. He was just standing with the leg. Oh, my God.
Miriam: Uh, the leg kills me. Please let me not have been the only person to have picked up on the awkward toe leg. Did he have a cramp, or was it just part of him being uncomfortable?
Laura: I think it's just like a weird you know how ladies pose when they're doing group shots and you put your hands on your hips and you do a little turn to make yourself look thin. I feel like he was just doing a little leg pose just to not be just standing there like he had to do a little thing.
Miriam: Or maybe his balls were slightly sticking to his leg. And he does that normally, but he's never seen himself do it in the nude. And so it looks a little silly. I don't know. But if that's Ryan, I mean, your.
Ryan: Balls do stick to the inside of your there's some powder on those thighs.
Laura: Yeah.
Ryan: Just get yourself a bit of talc. Just talc up.
Laura: Talc up.
Ryan: Talca peppers. Yeah, talca up. So you can those little sacks of love just like just make sure they're not sticking to your leg.
Laura: Little love sacks.
Ryan: Yeah, little love sacks.
Laura: Give them a little hairy love sacks.
Ryan: Yeah, give them a little pat down powdered.
Miriam: Pat mhm.
Miriam: Nothing says sexy like a man undressing for the first time. And he's got chucky white legs.
Ryan: This is one of the only scenes in the movie that works for me.
Laura: It's great. And this happens right after he shows Sarah the video of his last kill. So when he kills Aaron from the previous film, he shows that scene where Aaron's sitting on the bench looking over the lake. And know, Joseph comes over in his peach fuz, uh, werewolf mask with the axe and slams him in the head, which is I loved that video. I loved mean, to be fair, it's.
Ryan: Completely his own fault of his lack of self awareness. He deserved to probably die.
Laura: He's probably on his phone or something.
Ryan: Probably TikTok.
Laura: Uh, TikTok in 2014. Yeah, for sure. So he's showing her that video, I guess, trying to size her up, see what she thinks, and see maybe if she actually believes that he's a serial killer. Like he's been telling her the entire time, ever since she walked in the door. Um, so it's not working. She's not phased. And this is how she's been through the entire film. She's not phased by his bullshit, by this stuff that he's spewing at her. He's trying to scare her, as always, jumping out of closets or jumping around the corner and screaming in her face, which is where you get those jump scares, which did not work for me this time, actually. I did not get any jump scares this time. And he's not getting what he wants out of her. He's not getting that reaction. Like he's looking for some sort of reaction. She's just not giving him anything. So the tables are not turning necessarily, because she's not trying to kill him. But it's a different type of victim.
Ryan: Well, it's kind of the playing field is relatively leveled out.
Laura: Yes. Um, so at that point, this is where he runs upstairs and then comes back down wearing only a towel. And he just stands there against the wall and starts to explain how men in a locker with other men will slap each other with towels and women in the dressing room will undress in front of each other. And it's not an issue. But with a man and a woman, there's always a wall between them because they're always wondering what the other one looks like naked. So he just says, we need to tear down that wall. We need to tear down that wall. And asks if she's into it, asks if she consents to him disrobing. And she does. And he just whips off that towel.
Miriam: Are we not going to talk about the hand gesture? The hand gesture?
Laura: Oh, do tell. Explain it to me.
Miriam: He's doing his whole speech with this hand on his towel, like he's some Roman orator. And he does this heart forward, back forth hand maneuver. And I feel like we need to break down that boundary. And it's like this awkward hand gesture that he does. It's just like what you would do if you met an alien race and you were trying to be like me. Miriam um, you you well, that's what.
Ryan: All men do when they go into a steam room. Yeah, I did that.
Laura: You did that when you went into a steam room. You're just, uh gesticulating.
Ryan: And I just walk in there. I'm slightly leaning more on my left leg while my toes are kind of standing more on my right. And I'm just like, what's up, fellas?
Miriam: Gesturing.
Ryan: And then I just disrobe.
Laura: And you're gesturing this way and that.
Ryan: Yeah, I sit right next down to the guy who's got like and I have to lift his deck off because I need to sit there. So I put it back on his lap. And then I sit down.
Laura: And he just stands there for a.
Miriam: Very long time, proudly but awkwardly with the foot.
Laura: Proudly and awkwardly with his toe and his leg doing a funny thing, his left leg. But yeah, he just stands there not saying anything for several seconds. Um, and it's just that static wide shot, right? Am I saying it right?
Ryan: Ryan yeah, it's wide. It's not like when she disrobes and.
Miriam: It just zooms in straight. Oh, I thought that was really smart. You do see boo for, like, a second. You see, like, one nip.
Laura: I think he's not interested.
Ryan: Yeah, he's a liar.
Laura: He didn't care about well, he never.
Miriam: Said that he did. No, he just wanted to be naked in front of her and see her reaction. And so when she was like, cool, I'm going to get naked.
Laura: I mean, his original reasoning was that men and women always wonder what the other one looks like naked, so they should just get it out of the way. But I think that was just an excuse.
Laura: Yeah, you're right. I think it was an excuse to again, try to throw her off course, which didn't work because nothing he was doing was working. He's like, I'll show you my murder video. No, didn't work.
Miriam: Oh, I'll try to scare you.
Laura: Nope, that's not working either. I'll tell you, I'm a fucking murderer. Nope, nothing. Let me get my dick out.
Miriam: Still not uh let me get my.
Laura: Dick out all within the first ten minutes. Nothing. Doesn't blink an eye. She gets naked, too.
Miriam: But then the shot is like which I thought was really cool was that it was like just her face. He's still Quasi, like, oh, I'm probably going to kill her and she's going to die, and this video is going to be released into the world. But that doesn't mean that I want people to see her naked. He is just like, no, I just kind of want her to be like, my last big kill. She's mine. In that way. In that weird sociopath trophy kind of way.
Ryan: Well, I felt like the conception going into this movie was that his victims were predominantly male.
Miriam: Yeah.
Ryan: So with her coming in, um, it never felt like there was any sort of level of significant threat to her.
Laura: Right. Well, he also does explain that he did not intend to kill her. He intended because he was sick of it. He was bored of it. He didn't feel how he used to feel when he killed people. So he was trying to take this as a switch up because he always filmed all of his other murders. And he says in the film that he wants to film her murdering him and do the old switcheroo because and take down the king. I think he says something like that. Yeah, because he's tired. Uh, he already has 39 videos of him murdering people. Might as well switch it up and have someone murdering him just because he's over it. I don't know. I thought that was interesting. And I wasn't sure, and I don't think he was ever sure throughout the whole film whether or not he was actually going to have her kill him or was he going to murder her.
Ryan: Yeah.
Laura: So it was a weird thing because you never quite got a grasp on the relationship that was happening between the two of them.
Ryan: Yeah. I feel like that's just kind of into the poor writing.
Laura: Well, there wasn't any writing.
Ryan: There should have been.
Laura: I thought that was a really interesting part of the film. It stuck out to me like crazy when that happened.
Ryan: Well, of course it does, because that's you.
Laura: Yeah. This is what I do.
Ryan: Yeah.
Laura: This is my thing.
Ryan: Yeah. You could see that shit from space, that expression on your face.
Laura: Joy.
Miriam: Yeah.
Laura: Uh, it's the thing where we're so used to especially in horror of getting boobs, boobs, boobs, boobs, boobies, boobies. And in this film, you are given a straight, wide, full frontal shot of a man naked for a very long time. So you're getting a complete switcheroo, which you don't get. Like you don't get that I like that. I like that you're switching it up. You're turning it on its head. Your conceptions of what you are expecting in a horror film. And when it is her turn and she gets naked, it's like a split second, you get, like, a half nip.
Miriam: And then, like, another scene that I remember feeling like, I don't know what my level of discomfort is here, but it's pretty high. And it's like right after he has his way too long breakdown after the hilarious, um, birds and Shadows bridge scene. And then she finds him in the hot tub. Hot tub? Yes. And she finds him in the hot tub. He's at the point where he's like, you know what? Just go. I don't even care anymore. I'm done. And I'm like, just get the fuck out. Get the fuck out. Like, literally two scenes before this, you were staring at every fucking window trying to figure out how to fuck to escape this person. And they're literally disheartened enough to be like, just go. And instead, she listens to his sob story and then proceeds to get into the hot tub fully clothed, right? But behind him and starts awkwardly massage, choking him. And he's, like, grunting and making all these weird wolf noises. Which is another thing. He's obsessed with wolf sounds. He's like he's like, growling.
Laura: And she's like, I have to say, M Miriam, I kind of liked it.
Miriam: That was weird. I'm always rooting that somehow the psychopath serial villain does have a heart of gold and just really needed a Batman or a like, to just show up.
Laura: And like, Batman, what's Batman gonna do?
Ryan: What's Batman doing here in the woods? Vengeance.
Laura: Vengeance.
Ryan: Vengeance.
Miriam: You know, they're like it's like grendel and beowulf. It's a classic grendel and beowulf story again and again and again when you have a villain and a hero that are know, not kind of, uh, when.
Laura: It comes to movies like this. And you have a situation where you know the character is in danger, imminent danger. And she's getting warned. And she's getting warned. And she has outs over and over. And this could be he, she, whoever in any type of film. We've seen it before, but they don't listen to the warnings. She even says after she sees his dick and she says he whipped his dick out within ten minutes. And these red flags are popping up all over the place. And she said, this is going to be perfect for me. And she puts a knife in her boot. And so this is a person who understands the danger, that understands what's happening, in a way, but doesn't listen to herself and keeps putting herself in danger. When that happens, I'm rooting for the killer. Same all the way. I'm rooting for the killer. I go, you know what? You're dumb. You're not listening. You're genuinely just trying to get hits on YouTube.
Miriam: But at the same time, she's a fucking sociopath. Just like a serial killer gets off on killing people. She gets off on putting these people's weird lives on video. She gets off on, um, literally, when she goes to see these people, she's also mocking them. They're her victims. And it's like a different type of crime. They're both fucked up.
Laura: I like that.
Miriam: Yeah, that's what makes it interesting.
Laura: She's a damn crim. A dirty crim.
Ryan: Yeah, she's a whatever.
Miriam: There is a moment where I do think that the two of them actually do convince themselves that for a second that the other one is into them. Yeah, the vanity of the Predator is in both of them.
Laura: I thought he was going to well, not Bonnie and Clyde, but you know.
Miriam: Oh, he's Romeo and Juliet. That shit.
Laura: What's another way? Who are two people that killed like but on purpose?
Ryan: No, it was Romeo and Julie and Juliet.
Laura: Yeah, whatever. So he's know we're going to go out together.
Miriam: The original scream where the other person stabs you in the not vital organs. So I think that he stabbed himself. But he knows where not to stab himself because he stabs people a lot. Why didn't she just stay hidden in the dark and let him bleed to death? Yes.
Laura: Oh, yeah, ryan said that too. He's like, how long would it have taken for him to bleed out?
Miriam: Why wouldn't you just hide? What's wrong with you?
Ryan: And otherwise there would be no movie. Which is kind of just how by the numbers, this film ends up being.
Laura: Really well, no, I mean, it does change up a bit because at the end of the movie, uh, she also gets stabbed, almost buried alive. He almost dies. And then she hits it kind of goes back and forth. Like, you don't know who is dying. You don't know who the victim is. They're both the victim.
Ryan: On that note, though, it's a little nonsensical. Why do you mean why is it nonsensical?
Laura: But in what way does it not make sense?
Ryan: Because there's a lot of different ways it can go. And the issue is that because these characters choose to do things a very certain way, it sets up things that become unbelievable.
Laura: I don't understand. But that's okay.
Ryan: And also the film's intermerably boring. So I mean, by the time you do get to that point, you're just like, well, when is it over? Like, I'm checking on the Netflix timer.
Laura: Oh my gosh, it is a cool 80 minutes long. Yeah, it feels like 4 hours.
Miriam: I was like, oh my god. This is 1980s horror movie long.
Ryan: It's certainly not 1980s horror film quality.
Miriam: My happy ending, I kind of wanted her to be stalking somebody. And in that way because he had mentioned, like, I'm the master and you're my apprentice. And she's like, whatever. Because he could tell that she had these tendencies.
Laura: Well, also he does say when he was in the hot tub and they were discussing his murders and his, well, trauma, let's say that every victim that he's taken, which is 39 people, he takes a little bit of little bit of each of them. And he does assume maybe not their identity, but at least their names or are something that they have, like affectations that they have. Like, uh, pulling out his beard, hair, and, um, traits that his victims has. And so he's an amalgamation of every single one of his victims. So that would make sense, uh, if she were to do that. Because then he would have been her victim. And then she would have taken on a trait of her victim.
Miriam: Yeah. And that would have been interesting.
Ryan: But then she also didn't do the simple thing of just taking the camera after all was said and done.
Miriam: Yeah. Why did she leave the I would.
Ryan: Have taken why would you leave? Blows that whole thing out of the water.
Laura: As we're kind of getting towards the end of the movie, thank God.
Ryan: Um, I feel like there has been no stone unturned as opposed to the deep uncovering of creep too.
Laura: Well, how about let me ask Miriam, um, a question, miriam, would you recommend that people watch this movie?
Miriam: Wow. First of all, you would have had to have watched Creep One. So you would have sat through that film, which is interesting. Uh, and like I said before, the creep movies are like somebody who's really into murder, but also Larry David. So you have to be able to deal with that level of constant awkward.
Ryan: Um, I would rather watch Larry David than Mark Duplass in that role.
Laura: Oh, god. How weird would that be? I love that.
Ryan: Fucking awesome. Yeah. He's like, I don't want to use a public bathroom because I've trained myself not to use a public.
Laura: Uh know, I don't know if she recommends this or not. Is it no?
Ryan: Sounds like a no.
Miriam: Sorry.
Ryan: Nice. I like this.
Miriam: Damn.
Ryan: I like this persecution sandwich we are setting up.
Laura: Well, Mark Duplass is a classic white. Like, he's, uh, the classic good, uh, looking white man.
Miriam: Yeah, he's no John Stamos, but he's all right.
Laura: First person that comes to your mind when you think about a hunk.
Ryan: Why? What's wrong with John Stamos? John Stamos is a fantastic reference.
Laura: You guys are more alike than I realized. Um, okay, so, Ryan, would you recommend this?
Ryan: No. No, I wouldn't. Um, uh, it's not a good film. It's not a good film. And the thing is, I gave the original creep, um, because at least creep does get scary. The problem is that creep Two just does not develop any level of atmosphere. And the thing is, as much as it's trying to be a dark, uh, comedy, um, at no point is it ever really funny. And I never at any point felt uncomfortable. Like you guys have been saying for the last 40 minutes. I never felt uncomfortable. One time I felt confused. I felt trite. I didn't feel like I believed any of it. I mean, I was just kind of like, uh, when is this going to kick off so that it finishes it's a tiresome film that's now within a subgenre.
Laura: Oh my God.
Ryan: That's just following a beat plan. And it's just not particularly interesting. But the only good things about it are that those philosophical meaning like musings that are kind of going through it. And I love the idea that he's really taking a hold of this psychotic persona because if anything, all he's kind of done is he's read like the McDonald tree ad. And he's be like, well, I can just act like someone who inherits all of those traits of what makes up a serial killer. And then that's what it'll be.
Miriam: Uh huh.
Laura: Um, I would recommend this movie because you guys suck.
Ryan: Of course you.
Laura: Would. After the very beginning, which, as Miriam was saying, is the actual end to the other film, I do think it goes down a bit. The very beginning is very exciting, and I love that part. And after the penis scene, uh, at 24, 25 minutes in, it does go a little bit downhill. I do like it, and I do think that it's interesting and I would recommend it. So suck it. That's how I feel.
Ryan: Well done. Um, thank you. What a hill to die on.
Laura: So, Miriam, on a scale zero to five, five being the absolute best, how would you rate the visibility and context of the full frontal nudity in this film?
Miriam: Oh, wow. Um, context was, uh, just perfect. I think it was just out of the blue awkward. I loved it. I thought it was so weird. And you weren't really sure if he was going to go through with it. And I don't think he was sure about it. And then he did. It was exactly what I thought and more. And I was not upset. I don't know what else to say.
Laura: Great. Absolutely. So, Ryan, what about you?
Ryan: Zero to five. Um, it's the only scene in the movie I like. And I gave it five. Great. Because at least it works within the context of the escalation of moments, uh, in that, uh, sequence. But then the film just goes wildly downhill and uninteresting after that point.
Laura: Okay, um, I'm giving it a five. Obviously, it's different. It's different than the ones we've done before because it is so static and it's such a long shot that it differentiates itself from the rest of the scenes that we've done on the podcast. And it's different from a typical horror film. So it's greatly appreciated. I think it's different. It does something different. And it's, uh no frills. No frills. I like it. And I'm just going to jump in with my rating for the film. I gave it a three and a half. It's not my favorite. I liked know I usually give threes to things that I like. And then the half is, uh, just for funsies.
Laura: So, um, what would you rate the film, Miriam, out of five?
Miriam: Um, so we'll go on a scale of horror films. And on a scale of horror films, uh, Halloween and The Thing and Alien being a five, this movie was a, uh, 1.5. I'm, um sorry.
Ryan: Laura. Nice. Yeah, because she echoes my sentiment. Because it's not scary. It's not a horror movie for the most part. Uh, it's a, uh, victim of its own trappings, and those trappings are dull. Trite trophy.
Laura: What's the rating?
Ryan: One and a half, I said. Oh, you said one and a half already?
Miriam: Yeah. Oh, my God. Can I tell you a little excerpt that my lesbian friend told me about Shame the other day, which I really wanted to share on your podcast? Oh, yes, please. I had never heard of this film because I'm out of the loop, but my friend Emma, who is a very intense lesbian lovely. I had told her about your podcast, and she was like, oh, clearly she knows about the movie Shame. And I was like, I'm sure she does.
Laura: Why?
Miriam: And she's like, oh, I went to go see the movie. For some reason, it was at IMAX. And I went, what? She's like, Let me just point out the fact that when Michael Fassbender's, uh, scene was on the screen, it was so big, it would have put out everyone's eye had it been in three D, and it was more dick than this lesbian could handle. And I had to cover my eyes.
Laura: Wow. That's beautiful. Well, we will see you next time.
Ryan: 17, uh, episodes.
Laura: Tune in to the rest of Spooky Penis Month. And remember, if anyone wants to see what we're doing next, uh, get on our social medias, which is on the Beat bitte. And also, if people want to get really weird and deep with us, they can follow us on Letterboxed and watch, uh, what kind of trash that we're up to. And I think there's links in the bio on our Instagram for that. I don't know.
Ryan: Social media. There's links in the link tree that we have on the Twitter and the.
Laura: Instagram, and maybe we'll bully Miriam enough to get on Letterbox.
Miriam: I'm happy to do anything as long as it's not 17 episodes from now. Dice. Just want to add that in.
Laura: Okay, great. Well, yeah. Thanks again, guys, and we will see you next time.
Ryan: Yay.
Miriam: Spooky you.