Prison kisses! We're covering a David Mackenzie treat from 2013: STARRED UP
Oh boy. We've found ourselves in a bit of Barney Rubble, eh? However hard we try, we seem to find ourselves back in prison. And in this episode, you can listen to us in "real-time" literally figuring out how many "prison movies" we've already uncovered, and it's alarming.
We're back with Mr. Mackenzie after we did YOUNG ADAM all those episodes ago, and it's another pretty bleak and disheartening piece of cinema starring Jack O'Connell in a big bad man prison. Key words here: "Prison Kisses" and you won't be disappointed.
Enjoy! (hahah)
Prison Drama Unplugged: The Raw Reality of 'Starred Up'
Ryan: Ra ra ra ra ra.
Laura: Well, hello there. Welcome to On the BiTTE, the podcast that uncovers full frontal male nudity in cinema. My name is Laura and I am joined by my prison boy, Ryan.
Ryan: Your top geiza. Your top geiza, blood.
Laura: Can kanga.
Ryan: Yeah, I'm, um, I'm um, top blood gangster boy, I guess.
Laura: Definitely. Because we are here to talk about the 2013 prison drama Starred Up.
Ryan: Yeah.
Laura: Directed by our favorite David MacKenzie, starring Jack O'Connell, Ben Mendelsohn and Rupert Friend.
Ryan: My pal David has done it again. He has made a movie.
Laura: He did make a movie.
Ryan: Yeah.
Laura: 12 years ago.
Ryan: Well, I felt like we should have, you know, we needed to go on. We had to move on to something quite light after Salo
Laura: So this movie has some jokes?
Ryan: Yeah, kind of.
Laura: I laugh.
Ryan: It depends on. Yeah, it depends on how dark your humor is. Yeah. I mean these people are terrifying. I mean, I've grown up with people. Not maybe as bad as this, but I've grown up with people like this.
Laura: I mean, we're following up a friendship story. Salw with a friendship story.
Ryan: It's very true. It's very true. There's. There's. Well, the thing is, is like, if you really think about it, starred up in Salo have a lot in common. There's poop.
Laura: Yes.
Ryan: Um, there's some pretty fucked up, violent, horrible antics that are going on. Yes. Um, they're all effectively imprisoned. So there is that.
Laura: Definitely.
Ryan: Um, um, they will start up in Salo They both start with an S. Yep.
Laura: There you go.
Ryan: Y are u. Um, yeah, I don't think I need to say anymore.
Laura: No. But I can tell you an incredibly long synopsis that I pulled from letterboxed.
Ryan: Okay.
Laura: So we can get to know a little bit more about this week's movie.
Ryan: Just in case we were. We didn't know.
Laura: It is a paragraph and I'll try not to mess it up.
Ryan: I mean, paragraphs can be big. Anyway, let's see, let's just get over.
Laura: The paragraph I think is technically.
Ryan: Okay.
Laura: Four sentences at least.
Ryan: Okay, interesting. Okay, carry on.
Laura: Great. 19 year old Eric, arrogant, an ultraviolent is prematurely transferred to the same adult prison facility as his estranged father. As his explosive temper quickly finds him enemies in both prison authorities and fellow inmates. And his already volatile relationship with his father is pushed past breaking point. Eric is approached by a volunteer psychotherapist who runs an anger management group for prisoners. Torn between gang politics, prison corruption and a glimmer of something better, Eric finds himself in a fight for his own Life unsure if his own father is there to protect him or join in punishing him.
Ryan: And I, um, mean, we don't even need to talk about the movie now. We pretty much explained the whole thing. Jesus Christ.
Laura: Prison daddies. Prison friendsison.
Ryan: Prison prison. Prison boys.
Laura: Prison kisses.
Ryan: Yeah.
Laura: Prison lessons.
Ryan: Yeah. Yeah, it'yeah. What the fuck?
Laura: The amount of times we said prison kisses while watching the film.
Ryan: Yeah. There's some's. Some gay stuff in it, which is, which is, uh, pleasant. Yeah, love. Pleasant to the, uh, eye.
Laura: Because I always want to go. I go, kiss, kiss, kiss. And then when they do, I feel like I really won a prize.
Ryan: They were listening.
Laura: Yeah.
Ryan: Yeah. You were able to speak to them through the tv.
Laura: Absolutely.
Ryan: So here's the thing. I think getting into this movie, I don't think that the UK prison system. I don't know if they would have allowed that to happen.
Laura: Prison kisses.
Ryan: No. The son being in the same prison as his father, who's obviously like a career criminal. You know what I mean? Like, I don't know if that would ever happen. I don't know if that's something that they would do. They would try and keep them separate. But I don't like. I don't know. Like, I really don't know. It was something that niggled me a little bit and I'm like, u. Uh, this fucking thing. Like it didn't, like, it just didn't ring true.
00:05:00
Laura: The son, Eric, would have known that his dad was in that prison.
Ryan: Well, I think he did know he.
Laura: Was in that, but the papa, uh, wouldn't. I don't think he would have known that his son was coming to hang out with him in jail.
Ryan: I mean, maybe not, but I mean, I just don't. I just can't see how that works practically. I'm probably wrong. There's probably like full families of men, like in prison. Um. But yeah, I just don't. Yeah, I just don't really. I don't. I just don't. I don't know. I just don't know if that would work. I don't know if that. That felt like that. And there's a lot. Yeah, there's others, Stu. There's other stuff. We'll get to it. But yes.
Laura: I mean, it didn't work. It. No, not great.
Ryan: Spoiler alert.
Laura: The.
Ryan: The prison movie does not end really well. Well, it does kind of end happily. Ish.
Laura: I guess, for what it is.
Ryan: For what it is. Yeah. There's no Shawshank Redemption in this U.
Laura: Um, but there is A shank.
Ryan: There is a shank or two. Yeah. Blade brush, as I decided to call it. Blade brush.
Laura: I do want to come back. I do want to come back to prison Weapons. Yeah, In a minute. But I want to throw you the tagline and see what you think about it.
Ryan: Okay.
Laura: Uh, which is we're all different on the inside.
Ryan: What?
Laura: Yeah.
Ryan: What the fuck is that?
Laura: I'm not sure.
Ryan: You know what that sounds like. That sounds like a creative Scotland tagline.
Laura: Okay.
Ryan: Yeah, that sounds like shite. Pure shite.
Laura: Because it seems as though maybe we're all the same on the inside because we're all trying to be a little better instead of different. I felt like this movie was trying to show us that we're all the same.
Ryan: Yeah. I just don't think that, um. I just don't think it rings true. Like, it really doesn't kind of just think that fucking tagline'garbage like it's completely unrepresentative of what the film is. Because this film's not uplifting in the slightest. Like, it really isn't.
Laura: It's a prison trauma. It's straight up prison drama movie.
Ryan: Yeah. I just. I find that to be. Yeah, I just think'it's disingenuous. It's just. It's rubbish. It's utter rubbish.
Laura: Well, thank you. I'm glad that you agree.
Ryan: Oh, good. Thank God. Um, yeah. Just doesn'teah. Just doesn't make any sense to me personally. Doesn't make any sense at all.
Laura: Well, the title of this film references the early transfer of a criminal from a young offender institution to an adult prison. And I did count the amount of titular lines and I might have missed one.
Ryan: Mhm.
Laura: But I counted three, which is a real treat. A love. A titular line.
Ryan: Yep.
Laura: Three times.
Ryan: You could definitely do a comfortable drinking game out of this one.
Laura: Well, that'be kind of boring.
Ryan: They would. But then youd be like youd come at the end of the movie, you were just a little bit drunk and you're like, um, I'm ready for bd.
Laura: Because I think if you drank the amount of times they said fuck or cunt or anytime someone got a little upset, you would die.
Ryan: Yeah. You would die. Yeah. These are a bunch of angry people.
Laura: Said over 300 times. I lost count.
Ryan: I mean, it makes sense. Makes sense. I mean, there's a lot like people in the uk, we swear all the time. It's part of everything.
Laura: It's part of everything.
Ryan: Yeah. It's part of everything that we do and what we're Part of. Like, it's just the way it is. Like, I say cunt all the time.
Laura: I don't have a problem with it. I'm just.
Ryan: No, because I say I'm such a cheeky chappie. It's like. It doesn't offend you.
Laura: Um, no.
Ryan: Yeah.
Laura: No. The film was written, as you could imagine, by a former prison therapist named Jonathan Asser, based on his experiences.
Ryan: Okay.
Laura: Which is why he's the hero.
Ryan: That'why he's the hero.
Laura: Hm.
Ryan: He's just reflecting on his own personal.
Laura: Experience because he's a good boy. Teaching the prison boys how to control their emotions and not punch each other in the face. And this is our second David Mackenzie movie after Young Adam that y did young Adam, episode 84.
Ryan: Ooh, 84. You remember?
Laura: Yeah, I didn't remember. I looked it up because I thought you would ask.
Ryan: Okay, well, that's good. I wasn't going to ask that. Yeah.
Laura: It's not our first prison movie.
Ryan: No, it's not.
Laura: And not our first shower nude scene.
Ryan: No. We really. We're really screwed. Like, we're getting to the point where we're picking films effectively at random, but
00:10:00
Ryan: they keep on showing us the same things.
Laura: Themes. Y. Nude themes.
Ryan: Pretty much. Yeah.
Laura: Pre Muchah. We had hunger, episode 31, get Richard die trying, episode 23. So it's been a while since we've done a prison movie.
Ryan: I mean, there's also that bit in fucking Eastern Promises.
Laura: Right. Which is more of a shower. But that was also quite an early episode, which was episode 12. JZ, we're on 102. I think we are at this point.
Ryan: Yeah. That's 90 episodes ago.
Laura: It has been a long time since we've done a prison movie. So it feels nice. Feels cozy.
Ryan: Familiar ground. Yeah. Cause we did thisscape from Alcatraz as well.
Laura: Oh, my gosh, you're absolutely right.
Ryan: We love a prison movie. Absolutely love one, it seems. And this was completely, um. On Golver. We didn't even know.
Laura: Yeah, you're. Well, I knew this was a prison movie. Dang. When did we do that one? That was a while ago as well.
Ryan: It was. Yeah. Um, so it was probably in the 20s or something because we went to San Francisco and Elsor.
Laura: Yeah, that was for my birthday.
Ryan: Yeah.
Laura: Um, 53. Episode 53 was Escape from Alcatraz.
Ryan: Wow. Okay. Well, yeah, no, as you might be able to tell, we do love ourselves a little bit of a prison romance. Um, um. Which is obviously what they all are, but u. Uh, yes. We start off with Jack. What's his name in it? It'eric, right?
Laura: Correct. I'm not done.
Ryan: Oh, you're not done talking about what the. Like the film in general?
Laura: Yeah, you back up. You back up. You back off.
Ryan: I'm not done trying to get straight into the story.
Laura: No, I don't want to talk about it yet. So this film was shot sequentially over 24 days.
Ryan: Okay.
Laura: Which included 18 days of stunts.
Ryan: Okay.
Laura: It's a lot of stunts. And it was a. Of stunts shot almost entirely inlin Kummlin Road Gal prison in Belfast.
Ryan: Okay.
Laura: And they had some additional production, um, at a prison. Prison maze in Lisbournn. And some of the cast members actually felt that it would be beneficial to spend their entire stay in the prison itself instead of staying in a trailer in a hotel. I thought maybe. Maybe they thought it would help their performance.
Ryan: Yeah, I mean, I guess so. It's. I think it's like prisons. Prisons perme a certain atmosphere that I feel like. Yeah, it's kind of begs to question whether or not this is actually, uh, helping these people. Oh, to become better people, I think.
Laura: We know is not good.
Ryan: No.
Laura: And the prison system is rubbish. Rubbish and rubbish. False.
Ryan: Silly prison system. Yeah.
Laura: There was a lot of improvisation used. The writer of the film was actually on set, so he was able to help guide them when they were improvising. And this was particularly within the group scenes to kind of keep it more spontaneous.
Ryan: That makes sense.
Laura: David MacKenzie also talked about how this is his first genre film. And he was very excited about it. And he said, he's like, I've made eight films and this is my first genre film. Like, he wanted it. I think this is. This comes right after Perfect Sense, which I'm sure we will cover at some point because this is not our last Stepid Mackenzie film that we are going to talk about. But he was just really excited to get into something kind of raw and specific in this film.
Ryan: Yeah, no, it definitely suits his style.
Laura: Yes. Um, there'some great, really nice shots in it. There's that one shot where Eric is following his dad up the stairs in the prison later on in the movie.
Ryan: Yeah, N stuff. Yeah, that. That shot stands out because it's probably one of the most controlled shots in the whole thing. Because I don't. I personally don't think that that Starred up is a particularly good looking film. There's some nice flaring and stuff like that, but it's rather. It's rather samey all the way through that one shot that Jibs all the way up the stairs is something a little bit more special, I feel. But, yeah, I don't know.
Laura: It felt good.
Ryan: Uh, yeah. Or it stood out more because it. It was too good. Maybe.
Laura: I'll let you get into it now. I mean, we really do start off with a penis scene right in the beginning of the film. But if you had something else you wanted to add before we jump into that, please do.
Ryan: Um. Um. I don't really have a time. I mean, one of the things you did, and it's okay, but you had to put the subtitles on because the fucking dad. He mumbles something crazy.
Laura: Our air conditioner is quite loud as well, so that didn't help in the house.
Ryan: No, it didn't. So it was kind of just like.
Laura: It was loud in the house. And then M. Ben Mendelssohn and Ben Mumbelsson.
Ryan: Yeah. Just eating his way through the fabric of language. Just kind of mumble it. It's like it. Well, it wasn't as bad as, like, he's just, like, spitting out alpha Alphabet spaghetti, like, all over the place. But at the same time, you're kind of just like, what the fuck did he just say? You get a kind of. I feel like he's got a very. Like, he's got a very particular way in which he speaks to, like, his son and stuff like that, and his son understands him. So I feel like that's a very deliberate thing, but at the same time is. It was rough.
Laura: It was tough. It tough. M. I'm not embarrassed to put the subtitles on, but I did not understand quite a few of the original interactions that they had together, and I wanted to know what they were saying.
Ryan: Um, there's a lot of convincing slang and stuff being used in the movie as well. So it's kind of like. Is something that you have to kind of keep. Keep on top of.
Laura: Um, because I can understand a tough accent, but this wasn't even an accent thing. It was just. I couldn't. I couldn't hear anything.
Ryan: I think if you've been in prison for a while, you adopt ways of communicating between yourselves so that, like, guards can't hear you. And, like, they don't really have an idea. Like, they're always incredibly. I find criminals to be always incredibly secretive and doing things to try and make sure that they're not as understandable as they. They. You know, they. As anyone normally would be. U fair. And I feel like that's what he's. I feel like that's what he's probably doing U. Um, he's. I mean he's not. Yeah, he's not bad in the film. He's not bad for it. Other than the fact that we can't really understand anything he's saying.
Laura: I caught it later on. I don't know if it was the subtitles that helped or if I just got into it felt like I was there with them in prison.
Ryan: I think it was because he just started talking clearr. I think that was kind of just how it was. Um, and yeah, the subtitles did help to a certain degree. But I mean, I could understand everything they were kind of saying and I can understand what they were getting at. So I don't know. I don't know.
Laura: I could have turned them off. I'm really sorry.
Ryan: It's okay. I just. I let it be because, you know, you, you needed some help.
Laura: I did.
Ryan: And we're getting old. We're getting old now. No. What do you mean? We need as much help as we can this time next week. Uh, we'll need fucking audio descriptor on no to try and tell us what's happening and then we can try and fumble around and record.
Laura: Just go the full mile and put on that weird motion blurring thing on the tv, you know, Go back to factory settings and put on the audio descriptors and get me a walker.
Ryan: Yeah, it's over. It's happening. It's happening.
Laura: Um, U. I won't accept this.
Ryan: No, I guess not.
Laura: But what I will accept is three minutes into this film, in the very beginning, before we even hear our main character speak. Three minutes in, we start out with a classic prison introduction scene. In our very first panis scene, the.
Ryan: Legally allowed hazing, an undressing of the boy. And um, yeah, big bad boy Jackson. Big boy prison basically. And he's. U. Uh, yeah, he. This is when he first arrives, basically. So within the first opening minutes like you said. And he goes to undress because he has to.
Laura: They have to check him for weapons.
Ryan: They have to check him for weapons and they're checking his. His arhole for things that are in there because I mean there's there's at least one guy in this movie who, who pushes a mobile phone out of these. Out of his ah, asshole.
Laura: As you do.
Ryan: As you do. I mean if you're gonna keep it hidden, your asshole'probably one of the better places to put it.
Laura: I don't even know what that phone call was about. What was so important that they had to put the phone in the butt where did he get the phone from? He called his girlfriend, but then they just hung up. But also he touched the phone like he had it wrapped up in plastic wrap.
Ryan: No, it was a condom. He had it.
Laura: Ye. I thought it was a condom. But like, the way he unwrapped it was not. You would slide it out of a condom. He unwrapped it.
Ryan: Does he wrapp the condom round it after he put it in there? Cause it was all
00:20:00
Ryan: tied up.
Laura: Okay. I just feel as though there would be a lot of residue, booty residue on that phone. And he just put it right up to his face.
Ryan: It's prison, you know, you don't have the time. Plus, they had to phone. He had to phone his mess.
Laura: They all the time.
Ryan: Yeah, well, he had to make the phone call, he phoned them, and then they just had like a little argument and then he hung up the phone. So I don't know what.
Laura: There was no point to it. But we're three minutes in. That's way later. And yeah, you're kind of classic. He has to undress in front of the guards, make sure he doesn't have any phones in his butt.
Ryan: This is kind of like the opening of Escape from Alcatraz, basically. Yeah, same thing.
Laura: Yeah, basically. And. But he at least got to dress while he walked to his room.
Ryan: Yeah.
Laura: Didn't have to walk naked down the middle of the.
Ryan: Well, that's kind of ridiculous in that movie as well. But. Yes. It doesn't make sense. No, it doesn't. I don't know if it happened, but, uh, it would be like a humiliation technique anyway. Um, but yes.
Laura: So Jack O'Connell, our star Eric of the film, said, regarding the nudity, it's potentially scary, but in this film, the story warranted it. The director wouldn't have been able to use wider angles if I didn't go starkers, you know, I'm not going to be getting nudred every opportunity. That's not what it's about. It's just that, uh, artistically it felt right.
Ryan: I mean, he could have done wide angles. He just like, he cuts away to a different wide angle every time he starts to turn around. And that would be weird, you know, so, yeah, that's how you can get. That's how you just cut around it and. Yeah, no, I think, yeah, I guess, like, it comes down to authenticity because I guess that's the thing about hunger, um, is like, it feels very authentic. And I would say the same for startup to, you know, a certain degree. I think it's more down to the authenticity. Stems more from like the quality of the location, I guess.
Laura: Um, yeah, because the. The prison that they were shooting in closed in 1996, but it was a proper prison up until that point.
Ryan: Rightuse it. That's what it. That's what it looks like. And they're a little bit cookie car. I don't know if that. That prison'probably been used a few times for filming. It looked kind of familiar. But, um. Yeah, you've got to, uh. Yeah, you've got to kind of, um. You give a fair amount of props to how. I guess that kind of helps with the claustrophobia and stuff as well. Because they're not moving walls or anything. There's no sets for the most part.
Laura: There's no outside bits. There's, well, no music.
Ryan: I mean, and very comm. Is like outside bits. There are parts where they're outside but they're not outside.
Laura: Uh, yeah, they're in. They're in.
Ryan: They're inison the outside part of the inside prison where they get to just.
Laura: Walk in circles together.
Ryan: Pretty much, yeah. I mean, well, you can't. If you. If you can't do the time, you should not do the crime. That is my. That is my advice for you.
Laura: Oh my gosh. You should be a prison therapist.
Ryan: Children. Yeah.
Laura: You should be on Scared Straight.
Ryan: Yeah.
Laura: List Kidd.
Ryan: Just spend my days being called and nonce and like. Like all the time. Justably shouted.
Laura: It probably getting stabbed.
Ryan: Sounds very similar to my current job. Um, but yes. What? Getting. Yeah. Thrown to the wolves.
Laura: My.
Ryan: Um.
Laura: Goodness.
Ryan: Yeah. But no, I would say that, uh. Yeah, that seems like a fucking horrific existence. And uh. Yeah, I would not be happy with it. It's all.
Laura: It's almost, uh, 10 minutes into the film until we hear Eric speak anything. And then almost immediately after, he almost bites an officer's dick off through his trousers. Who happens to be named Officer Johnson.
Ryan: Yeah, it was.
Laura: What a treat.
Ryan: Yeah. Like, I mean, even before this, he's made like the first thing he does when he gets in his cell is he makes a fucking knife. Like almost immediately.
Laura: M. Give. I mean, he gets all these treats to bring back to his cell. He's got. What is it? Cornflakes.
Ryan: Cornflakes or radio? Uh, a toothbrush. Shaving. Like a shaving
00:25:00
Ryan: razor.
Laura: Disposable razor.
Ryan: Yeah.
Laura: And he. And a lighter and cigarettes.
Ryan: Ye.
Laura: But he makes a little knife out of the toothbrush and it's very intricate and very cleveruse. You can tell from that moment that this is your Opportunity to see that this man has been in the system for a while and he's learned a lot of tricks and tips.
Ryan: Yeah.
Laura: But he makes this knife and he hides it in the light in his cell, like in the ceilingeah. My problem with this, and I'm glad we're coming back to the weapons here. Now, maybe it's British prisons, but there are many, many, many, many things that can be used as a weapon that are readily available that you dont have to make. You don't have to fuck up your toothbrush and break your razor in order to hurt somebody. They have electric kettles in every single cell. You can make boiling water. There are people playing pool. They have pool cues and balls on the tables. Like, I mean, you can make all these things, so what is the point of making?
Ryan: Well, all those things you just. All those things you just mentioned are either items that are accounted for and two are items that you can't fucking hide anywhere. Where are you hiding the kettle full of hot water that you're gonna put on some of these. You're gonna fucking melt their face with.
Laura: A lot of these people don't care that they're getting caught fighting.
Ryan: No, I mean, they're in prison. They're not very good people. They're not too worried about law and order.
Laura: If he takes a, uh, pool ball or a pool queue and slam someone over the head with it.
Ryan: Well, usually you take a bar of soap and you stick it in a long sock. That's what happened to him when obviously the next dick scene happens and. No, I get what it is. I mean, if you ever seen scum, that's what he doesn't. Scum. That's what Ray Winston doesn't. Scum. He gets the pool ball and puts it into a long sock. We're all aware. Yeah, we're all aware. But he makes a fucking shiv.
Laura: I mean, he does use it, so.
Ryan: I guess does use it.
Laura: I guess it came in handy.
Ryan: Like, I guess he, like, he had one. Like, to me, it felt like that's just something he does routinely to every prison that he goes to.
Laura: Okay.
Ryan: Is that he makes himself a little knife and that's, you know, that's his thing. So. Yeah, I don't know. And, uh, it made me kind of feel. Well, I mean, you also made that like, as you get to see dad sell, Daddy sell, and you get to see like, the picture and you're like.
Laura: Oh, my God, I loved that difference between the walls and daddy's cell because you have the porno wall on one side and then you have the other side, which just has a little drawing that his son made on the wall. And it's got daddy, mama and son, and it says I love you, daddy on it. And it's just been on the wall for 20 years while this man'been in prisonah. But you can see both of the walls in the same shot. So you've got the porno wall and you've got the I love you, daddy wall.
Ryan: Yeah.
Laura: And it's just heartbreaking.
Ryan: It's fucking hilarious. Yeah, your reaction to it was fucking hilarious. Cause then you made the joke where you'like well, I thought you thought his dad had been in prison for five years.
Laura: No, I knew that the dad had been in prison since his son was.
Ryan: Five years and you called him bad baby.
Laura: Well, yeah, if his. If someone had been in prison since they were five years old, they would have been a really bad baby. I don't know what baby would have been in jail since they were five.
Ryan: No, no, I mean, I'm just. I'm, um, just repeating things that were said. But yeah, he does. He bites them. He bites them in the fucking deck as well. Well, he does a Bronson first. Covers himself in baby oil and stuff like that. Uh.
Laura: Oh my God, that's another prison movie that we did.
Ryan: Yeah, I mentioned Bronson earlier. Anyway, O. Ah, yeah. So, you know, there's a lot of prison movies in our repertoire, it seems. Right, right. So.
Laura: Well, they get naked in prison. That was episode 89.
Ryan: Wow. Yeah, we really like to spread them out thinly over the course of like, uh, our podcast episodes.
Laura: Every 30 episodes or so, uh, we'll revisit prison, go back to jail.
Ryan: But that's the thing. Like, the film's full of like. Well, it's full of a bunch of folk becausee, you know, they're hard becausee they say cunt constantly, cunt this, cunt that, all the fucking time. And also saying fuck. But yeah, it's uh.
00:30:00
Ryan: Yeah, like if you can get over the fact that like these there's a bunch of men using the word cunt, then you're gonna have a hard time. Gonna have a hard time with this thing.
Laura: I don't think anybody that puts on the film start up Directed by David MacKenzie is going to be offended by any of those words or phrases.
Ryan: No, they'll probably mean not for them. No, probably not. But it does have prison kisses.
Laura: Sweet, sweet prison kisses.
Ryan: Yeah.
Laura: Oh my gosh. It's like they know my heart. I love it. I Don't know if there's too much that I want to chat about. I mean, I could talk about prison kisses for quite a while, and I will talk about them again.
Ryan: Yeah, well, I don't. Yeah, I don't have anything other. Other than the next. Other than the next penis scene. Because it's like we then start talking about. Then this happens, then there's this.
Laura: But in the movie, there's a lot of friendship.
Ryan: There is. This is a tale of friendship, as it always is. Yeah. You can always bring it back to friendship.
Laura: Um, because without friends, you're nothing.
Ryan: No, Jo, I'm joking. I'm joking. Yeah. But, yeah, there's a few things that. I mean, the thing is, like, the stuff that does happen, some of it isn't that particularly interesting.
Laura: Okay, all right, let's just dip into the interesting part, which is our second and final penis Sc. Which is an hour and a minutees into this motion picture, which is Prison Shower Attack.
Ryan: Is a prison showerit attack. He has made a couple of enemies, um, because he's a bit mouthy and he's. Yeah, he's just e. Eric's just a little bit angry.
Laura: He's very upset.
Ryan: He's annoyed.
Laura: We don't know. I'm sure he has a chemical imbalance of some sort.
Ryan: Probably. It might just be the years and years of abuse.
Laura: Yes, a lot of abuse. He did mention some peo attacks. We don't know why any of these men are in prison.
Ryan: That is the interesting thing.
Laura: I do love that.
Ryan: Yeah.
Laura: Because you don't need everyone's backstory, because it's not. I don't know. It.
Ryan: It's not interesting.
Laura: I mean, it's a little interesting.
Ryan: The story of him. Of him attacking a pedophile by putting in, uh. By melting sugar in water and boiling it and then pouring it onto the man and is kind of fucked up.
Laura: Super fucking 10 years old. He said.
Ryan: Yeah, but you shouldn't. You shouldn't be.
Laura: I did like his. I did like his story about that. About how the pitos make you think that it's your fault and not their fault.
Ryan: Yeah, true.
Laura: And I liked his tail, but I liked that he melted a guy's face.
Ryan: Yeah, good for you. It's kind of forgivable if it's a pedophile. But the thing is, is that, yeah, we get these little things and we're. What I meant was that, uh, yeah, he's been making some enemies and, uh, someone attacks him in the fucking shower.
Laura: Did feel a little confused at points about who was angry at him. And then I knew who his friends were. But then this other group that were upset, I was confused. And then there was a prison boss, and he confused me as well.
Ryan: The prison boss is easily the fucking shittest character I've seen in a long time.
Laura: He looks like.
Ryan: Yeah, he looks stupid.
Laura: Dante from Clerks.
Ryan: He looked like the poor man's. The poor man. Satan. You know, I mean, just without the. Without the pitchfork in the fucking ears.
Laura: Like if Dante played Satan, um, with glasses, maybe.
Ryan: Yes. We're an trackuit top.
Laura: I know, I'm stretching.
Ryan: Yeah, you are really stretching.
Laura: But he looked like Dante to me. The goatee did it.
Ryan: He was kind of rubbish.
Laura: He was a point. I don't think he made any sense. I didn't like his character. He just was there. I didn't understand that he was important. I didn't care about him. And I didn't understand the other group that was upset.
Ryan: Well, I think they were together. They were part of the same group. And then there was the. Obviously the big guy from the kitchen as well. He was also getting these. He was also getting a piece because.
Laura: He touched his bread and potatoes.
Ryan: He touched it. Well, he shouldn't. Yeah. You should be wearing gloves if you're working in the kitchen. That's kind of gross.
Laura: Prison kitchen. Okay, sorry. I digressed. Uh, now we are back in Prison Shower Attack.
Ryan: We are. And, yeah, he's getting attacked with a fucking long sock and a. Probably a bar of soap. And
00:35:00
Ryan: then he starts choking him and he's fighting and he's writhing around. And that's when you kind of get a right big eye. Fool of everything.
Laura: Yeah. A classic Prison Shower Attack. Aah. The things that the films we already.
Ryan: And it get spoke about. It gets to move around a lot more. It's a lot more in motion than usually. Usually a penis would be. It's kind of like flopping over. You get to see the other side of it. Like, everything's all stuff'all. Stuff's going on.
Laura: But, uh, fighting for his life.
Ryan: There's a level of event that m. Haven't covered before.
Laura: Not his penis.
Ryan: No.
Laura: They're all attached. Everyone's fighting for their lives here.
Ryan: They are. Well, he's already kicked the shit out of this one assailant already. At some point, he's, you know, to the point where he. He's stuffed his head down a toilet and got him in the poop. Poo, you know?
Laura: Yeah, he had poop on his face. There's a lot of poop on the face'poop.
Ryan: Mhm.
Laura: Just like Salo
Ryan: Yeah. But like, what I mean is like he's writhing around on the floor and stuff like that. Like we get like that. We get to see a lot more going on and everything's moving around a bit more.
Laura: There is a great amount of visibility in this prison shower attack. Full frontal.
Ryan: Mhm.
Laura: Nudity scene. Absolutely. This is true.
Ryan: Yeah. You know, it's incredibly well lit for.
Laura: Being a very small space. There's a lot going on in quite a lot of movement.
Ryan: Yeah.
Laura: I have another quote from. I have another quote from Jack O'Connelll regarding this scene in particular. Um, he said that I think I did have the option to wear a modesty part contractually. I don't know if there was a clause, but I think I made the decision not to bother because of what the scene entailed and it was all very violent. I didn't want to compromise it at all. Uh, he also said I was a bit nervous beforehand because it was winter and Belfast and we didn't have central heating. And with the shower, obviously with the steam issues, they couldn't have it that hot. So I thought it might have affected things down there. And he said, I thought if it appears, then hopefully it's not the centerpiece of the scene. I was busy getting strangled, so to speak. So it kind of escaped my thinking.
Ryan: Yeah, it's pretty much there, dude. It's hard to not see it.
Laura: Yeah. Um, but Bravo for being brave and just going for it and.
Ryan: Yeah.
Laura: Not having to think about it. He said it was February when they filmed it.
Ryan: Yeah. It sounds like murder.
Laura: Yeah. It probably sucked.
Ryan: Yeah. No, I think good for him. Good for him. It should be, it should be applauded more. So it's like it. No one really talks about, like, remember what Jack O'Connell did and starred up. No one really kind of talks about it. Uh, they should, maybe they should be. Think what I mean is like, he's not the. He is not the center of like, uh, like media gossip because he's done this thing, you know, unlike some, maybe some actors who maybe would, you know, make a big, big fucking deal out of it.
Laura: Didn't David MacKenzie also direct Outlaw King?
Ryan: Yeah.
Laura: So you have Chris Pine in that movie. Righth. Um, where everybody's talking about how he's nude in that film.
Ryan: Yeah.
Laura: If the camera, the camera genuinely couldn't have been further away. You cannot see this man at all. And everyone's talking about this nude scene of Chris Pine. You can't see it Damn thing. Oay. And then you have this other David MacKenzie movie that we're talking about right now, which is just. And Jack O'Connelll is famous enough. He's known.
Ryan: Well, he's more famous now than he was before.
Laura: It's just proably. Well, yeah, that's fair. But these are the kind of things that I think maybe would have been talked about more.
Ryan: Yeah, potentially. Potentially. But like, I mean, I just don't think it's. Yeah, it's not that interesting to talk about either. I think it's just. It should be long have.
Laura: We do have a podcast about it, though.
Ryan: We do, but I think, uh, we. We approach it differently. You know, we're not. We're not in this for fame and fortune, are we?
Laura: I hope not do.
Ryan: Because that's fucking sading.
Laura: Uh, yeah.
Ryan: Um. But yeah, no, I think that.
Laura: I think that it's important to have those moments of honesties. Yes. Where you're going out there, you want to be honest to your character and you want to do what's right for the film. And
00:40:00
Laura: I think that he accomplished that.
Ryan: Yeah. He wasn't wearing underpants in the shower, which would have been weird. What? It have been really odd.
Laura: It would have been super weird.
Ryan: What the fuck? You.
Laura: Yeahus. Yeah. And again, it's not one of those films where you're watching it and you go, oh, Jesus Christ, a penis. Like, what the fuck? You know, that's probably the last thing you're thinking about when watching this movie and the scenes is because he's getting strangled in the shower and it's very scary and it's incredibly violent. So, yeah, you're not going like, uh, oh, look at that. Look at that dick.
Ryan: You know where at it go. Yeah.
Laura: We only notice because it's our job. I didn't write down my ratings, so I'm gonna have to come up with him off the top of my head.
Ryan: So that means no.
Laura: Oh, no.
Ryan: Oh, no. You're in Barney Rubble trouble.
Laura: I got it. Go. Why don't you go first, Ryan, and tell us about your ratings?
Ryan: Um, u. Well, I guess for visibility in context, it's gonna be hard to buck a five because it all makes sense. Um, and if it wasn't visible, then yes, we'd all be having. We'd all be having some concerns. But yeah, I like the fact that he's approached this with a level of authenticity because that was that. That's. The very least he can do is to make sure that he approaches this with some level of authenticity and I think he does, yeah. I mean, I think the scene itself. I mean, I'll get into the film. The film, it'll be slightly more scathing. But, um. Yeah, no, I think it makes sense for what it is and why it's happening and the fact that it's, you know, it's visual and we're camera'wider and such. What. But, uh, uh, when it comes to the film. The film. The film is fine. Like it's better than. It's better than average, let's put it that way. But I do have issues with some of the. The inst. The scenes. The scenes that really slow it down and make it a little bit uninteresting is all the institutionalizing stuff. Like it's garbage. Like the fucking lead warden, whatever fucking name is that her lackey. The guy who's just like, we need to just throw them in a warehouse and throw away the key. And he's like actively murdering folk, like prisoners in the prison that he does not like. And he's just like, fuck it. We'll just make it look like a suicide. All this sort of stuff. And I'm like, okay, okay. Um, but like, yeah, it's just a little bit. It's just a lot of the same thing. And that institutionalizing stuff just isn't fucking interesting. And I think there's actually something that's really good here. It's just like, it's too busy and it's distracted by other guff and stuff that I just don't think's that fucking interesting. So the film itself, I only gave like a three and a half because there's a lot of stuff in it that's like really good. But there's a lot of stuff that just really brings it down. And you're just like, u. Uh, like, let's just. Let's get. What's the point of this? Basically, you know, it. Is it about a father and a son? Is it about this. Is that about friendship? It's about like, you know, how. How will prison heal me? Like, I'm just, um. I'm kind of just like. I don't really understand it. And I don't really understand what the film itself is trying to say other than telling me that prisons bad, you know, I m like, okay, well, yees. It's pretty bad, is't it? I mean, we've covered enough of these fucking prison films to know that they're bad. But there's just. To me, there's no driving force in the film because I don't Feel like. I feel like maybe he's. He's changed slightly, but he doesn't, he doesn't come out a different person at the end of this. He's pretty much just the same guy and he's destined to do this for the rest of his life. Which I don't think is a very healthy prison message anyway. You know what I mean? Even though it's relatively quite realistic.
Laura: So.
Ryan: Yeah, I don't know.
Laura: Well, okay, so visibility in context 5. Yes, sure. Why not? Why not 5? I love his dedication to his craft, so to speak, to the scenes, to the film. And I know that he, before taking on this role, had a lot of conversations with the writer and with David MacKenzie as to how authentic could they be. And I think that it probably helped with the film being shot in, uh, in sequence as well.
Ryan: And I don't know if I believe in that sort of thing too muchly without it feeling like it should have been done. I guess very specific films, I think, work when they're done that way.
Laura: I guess maybe it would have helped if we did
00:45:00
Laura: see a little bit more growth from the character. But I did find, okay, the thing.
Ryan: Like his Boys in the Hood, um, shots sequentially, which I think is very clever because that's like. That's like a film that's like it's ready to explode at a certain point. Like it has a big drive that kind of leads it towards its ending pretty much. And Startup doesn't really have that. Like, it doesn't really kind of really ramp up to that point. So obviously we have the father son battle.
Laura: Right.
Ryan: But like, you feel like it's been a lot of the same thing, like over and over and over again. So I don't know if I believe incredibly that like, shing it sequentially was any sort of added benefit to the film whatsoever.
Laura: Okay.
Ryan: Other than. Yeah, other than just like, it's like, oh, we're just in prison longer. So it's almost as if you're like, you're with the journey with us. And I'm like, okay. They're basically acting the exact same way they did at the beginning as they do at the end. Many we carry on. Um. Um.
Laura: Right. So I don't know. Visibility and context. I don have. I guess I don't have too much more to add other than what youve ve said. I just appreciate that it was done. I also appreciate that it's not the focus of either one of those scenes. It just is what it is based on the setting and the story. And if it wasnt there, it would be odd. So there you go in the film. Im going to give the film A4. I liked the film, but I probably could knock it down to three and a half at some point if I watched it again. Uh, same as you, Ryan, because I was confused at points, uh, like I said before, about who these, some of these people were and why some of these people were there and. Yeah. What the drive. Whats the focus? Because theyre talking about gangs. Im like, what gangs? What gang?
Ryan: It's like W side Story. They were all goingna start dancing us.
Laura: But, like, who is the gang? Is it because some of the men were black and some of them weren't black and that makes a gang? I don't think so.
Ryan: No, that wasn't it. Ah, I don't think.
Laura: Who are these people that were gang. There was a gang of friendship that I noticed, and he was a part of that gang of friends. He was who were literally there to help each other and to pull each other out of the toilet and watch their backs and give shampoo when they had poo poo on their head. Like, that's friendship.
Ryan: Yeah.
Laura: I don't know what gang they're talking about because I wasn't fleshed out enough for me to understand who the fuck these other people wereeah. Like the soap boy or Dante from Clerks or the guy with the, uh, potato fingers. I don't know who they were.
Ryan: Yeah.
Laura: And I don't know why they. I mean, they were mad because he was a spicy little boy. But overall, I still liked it because I was interested and it wasn't very long of a film.
Ryan: You should write synopss for films. He was a spicy little boy.
Laura: Well, when he walked in in Movie Star, I go, he's an infant, you know? And then I'm talking about angry. He's an angry bad boy, baby. Right? I should. You're right.
Ryan: Yeah.
Laura: Letittterbox.
Ryan: Um. Oh, man. Uh.
Laura: Hit me up.
Ryan: Yeah.
Laura: Hit me.
Ryan: If anything that's like, that's cemented that we'll never get anything from Litterbox. Never.
Laura: I've been using Litterbox before. They were on the red carpet runways.
Ryan: Okay, all right. Calm down. Christ. Bigan fucking. But her like the guy with the mobile.
Laura: I'm not hu.
Ryan: I'm big fanoper.
Laura: Big fan of Litter Box. So I like this motion picture, and it's not gonna take up too much of your time. And no, there's prison kisses, there's best friends, and there's poo poo, and you know, what more can you ask for?
Ryan: It's a right gay old time. It really.
Laura: I love you daddy. You know.
Ryan: Oh, don't. Yeah, I know what you do.
Laura: Any. Anything else you want to add?
Ryan: No, I do not.
Laura: Uh, well, thank you for uh, joining in this additional prison. I should count them up. That would be fun. I need to do that. Make a spreadsheet and figure out how.
Ryan: Prisonvie another grid for Laura.
Laura: I love a spreadsheet. And yeah, we'll do another prison movie at some point. Coming to you from the prison shower. I have been Laura.
Ryan: Thatl be right Cunt.
Laura: Thats true. Make sure trues not fairar. Well, as your character. The character that you just wr.
Ryan: Yeah.
Laura: Okay, make sure to follow us on letterboxed which you can find on our Instagram at on the bitte B I T T E.
00:50:00
Laura: And yeah, if you guys see a wiener, just send us an email. You can find it on our website.
Ryan: Which is also onthebitte.com Please, please send us correspondence. We need to feel as if people are listening.
Laura: I know that they are.
Ryan: I hope so. Than fucking hope so.
Laura: Thanks guys.
Ryan: Hope so. See you validation.
Laura: Bye.
Ryan: What you talking about? You can't. You cun'ts.
Laura: I should have counted how many times they said cunt instead of counting the titular lines. But I would have been really busy.
Ryan: Yeah, he would have been busy.
Laura: I wouldn't have too busy.
Ryan: Yeah, you couldn't do a drinking game out of that. No, no, you'd be dead before you got like halfway through.
Laura: Yeah.
00:50:55